User talk:Boodlesthecat

Family Feline Fun'Family Feline Fun'Family Feline Fun'Family Feline Fun

Thanks for your encouragement. I've taken a first stab at editing it, so you can let me know what you think. You could improve the article by adding specific citations from your references, in addition to listing them below.--Parkwells (talk) 21:49, 4 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Any help you can offer to make this article compliant with WP:NPOV is greatly appreciated. Thank you, 76.87.47.110 (talk) 11:02, 29 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

If you take the time to look at the main Ralph Nader article's editing history, you can see that the Atlantic quote in question, which was originally there, was moved here by compromise. I have been involved with these articles for over six months. What gives you the right to violate this compromise that was reached after a whole lot of haggling? Please respect other editors' wishes and let this comment stay. Otherwise, I will have to insert it back in the main article and revisit the compromise arguments there. Moreover, as to the Ralph Nader article itself, where is the POV in this: "Nader's greatest impact was in Florida in the 2000 election, where George W. Bush defeated Al Gore by 537 votes and Nader's 97,421 votes tilted the election in Bush's favor." You can't disagree that his campaign in 2000 had more of an impact than his other campaigns, right? And if you agree with that statement, then you have to explain why it had an impact. I don't know how much more carefully I can tread without stepping on hypersensitive toes. Griot (talk) 02:59, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You were asked to provide a source for the unsourced "tilted the election" statement. Wikipedia is based on reliable sources. Boodlesthecat (talk) 03:28, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry if I deleted a comment of yours. I did it by accident, I assure you. Now my question is how to address the fact that Nader's biggest impact was in 2000. That belongs at the top of both articles. No more white-washing, please. Nader would have been a footnote to the elections if not for his role in 2000 in Florida. I'd appreciate if you wouldn't insist on glozing over this fact, as much as you may dislike it. Griot (talk) 05:14, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You offered and we had agreed that you would supply sources for your claims (you said you could find hundreds). Yet you persist in reverting the unsourced claims in the lead and susbstituting rhetoric and accusations of "whitewashing." This is not a substitute for a reliable source. You are not keeping your agreement; I will revert out the claims until you supply reliable sources for it as you PROMISED--that's fair. Boodlesthecat (talk) 13:42, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi there, I'm a reporter working on an article about Wikipedia and I would love to speak with you. May I send you an email to try to set up an interview? Thanks for your time.Marynega (talk) 16:56, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Which newspaper?Boodlesthecat (talk) 17:14, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on Ralph Nader. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions in a content dispute within a 24 hour period. Additionally, users who perform a large number of reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring, even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing. Please do not repeatedly revert edits, but use the talk page to work towards wording and content that gains a consensus among editors. If necessary, pursue dispute resolution. Gwernol 23:30, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This warning also applies to Ralph Nader's presidential campaigns Gwernol 23:32, 30 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi again, I'm a reporter with SF Weekly newspaper. My email address is [email protected] May I give you a call to interview you for the article I'm writing about Wikipedia? Thanks for your time, Mary71.5.63.2 (talk) 00:43, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry--I forgot to sign that last one. I'm a reporter with SF Weekly newspaper. My email address is [email protected] Thanks for your time, MaryMarynega (talk) 02:12, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Now you've followed me to the Matt Gonzalez article. C'mon man, gimme a break. You don't know the City or its politics. Your editing there was strictly personal. Griot (talk) 16:44, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

See the talk page for discussion. Please refrain from using my talk page for your speculations and insults, and rude advice on what I can and cannot edit. Boodlesthecat (talk) 16:46, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry Cat. Griot (talk) 16:50, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'm sorry, but I have to take this back to your Talk page, since your edits at this article obviously don't pertain to Matt Gonzales, but to me. You dislike me so you followed me to this article, where you've been cutting huge portions of it out without regard to the fact that the material is sourced and arrived at by many editors who preceeded you. That is unfair to me and other editors. I answered your queries on the Talk page. Cut it out, wouldya? Griot (talk) 17:15, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on Matt Gonzalez. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions in a content dispute within a 24 hour period. Additionally, users who perform a large number of reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring, even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing. Please do not repeatedly revert edits, but use the talk page to work towards wording and content that gains a consensus among editors. If necessary, pursue dispute resolution. Gwernol 17:21, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Gwernol 20:13, 31 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

In reply to your e-mail: You are blocked because of your own actions. Each editor is judged on his or her own merits. Enumerating the bad things that the other editor has allegedly done is not an argument that addresses the only pertinent question here: how, specifically, did your block violate our blocking policy and should therefore be lifted? Sandstein (talk) 06:43, 1 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. I'm basically in agreement with Ralph Nader's views. I'm trying hard to make the article accurate and NPOV. If you and I should disagree, it's probably over minor matters of rhetoric. -- Writtenonsand (talk) 20:44, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I guess I stand corrected as to whether the presidential articles are biographical. Nevertheless, whether his supporters can handle it, I think our man Nader is a big boy with a good strong backbone, and he can handle criticism in person or on Wikipedia. These criticisms are not malicious or gratuitous--but let's let others decide, eh? I think you and I have been around this subject once too often. BTW, you put your comment on my User page, not my Talk page. If you want to address me in future, please do so on my Talk page. User pages are meant only for their owners. Feedler (talk) 23:56, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Boodles, I'm afraid User:Feedler is a sock puppet of User:Griot. 76.87.47.110 (talk) 20:39, 3 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You too, huh? You're in the paranoid category? Griot (talk) 01:25, 4 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You as well as anybody knows that it took a long time to reach the compromise that made up the opening paragraphy of this article. Yet you delete it wholesale. Why? And then you accuse me of being a sockpuppet merely because I disagree with you. Why do you do this? And Moonriddengirl is not an authority on which quote should be in an article. Please respect the editors there as well. People are going to disagree with you on Wiki, and that's okay. You have to realize that. Griot (talk) 16:43, 4 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Here's where compromises were reached on this passage. Please click the links and observe how other editors rejected your edit:

• Me on Feb. 4
• Sedlam on Jan 31
• Snowfire Jan 27

Please respect other editors. Griot (talk) 17:03, 4 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, compromises are reached in discussion pages, not proclaimed in article edits, as you seem to think from the diffs you offer above. You have a unique view of what a "compromise" is. feel free to try again. Boodlesthecat (talk) 18:05, 4 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

User:Sedlam is a sock puppet of User:Griot. 76.87.47.110 (talk) 03:42, 5 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Dude has a closetfull of socks ;)Boodlesthecat (talk) 04:55, 5 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No doubt, Boodles, no doubt. Sad, really. Have you seen this yet? Gadzooks, 76.87.47.110 (talk) 06:24, 5 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The Evola article states: Evola further held that Jewish people denigrated lofty "Aryan" ideals (of faith, loyalty, courage, devotion, and constancy) through a "corrosive irony" that ascribed every human activity to economic or sexual motives (à la Marx and Freud). — Do you perhaps know where this is from and able to cite it? Because that's quite a controversial statement and needs to be sourced. — EliasAlucard (Discussion · contribs) 11:03, 6 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I didnt write it but I'll look for a source, though it's hardly any more controversial than any of this fascist's other anti-Semitic pronouncements. Boodlesthecat (talk) 13:41, 6 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, but why did you remove the part about Freud and Marx? I found that particularly interesting and in need of a source. — EliasAlucard (Discussion · contribs) 04:47, 7 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

As I pointed out, I didn't write it, and don't have a source to verify it. You can leave it in but it will probably stay tagged for a very long time, since much of this artcile was written in an essay fashion without references. Boodlesthecat (talk) 05:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Boodles, I added User:Griot persistent violations to ANI, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents. He has deleted content on article talk pages and reverted inappropriate comments my talk page as well. 76.87.47.110 (talk) 21:02, 6 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Grazie indeed Boodles! A million of 'em :) 76.87.47.110 (talk) 06:05, 7 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, by the way, I agree that it would be in your interest to open a user account; makes things less confusing and distracts from the valid complaint you have. Cheers Boodlesthecat (talk) 06:11, 7 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've been thinking about it, maybe I'm commitment phobic :) 76.87.47.110 (talk) 06:28, 7 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/Telogen

I must say, with all the evidence against User:Griot, and the many incivility warnings I've noted with this new User:Calton, there is something not right about this. 76.87.47.110 (talk) 01:31, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Desperate attempt by a desperate editor who got B-U-S-T-E-D. It's classic online pathology. Enjoy the show! Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:43, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Kudos Boodles! :) Btw, I'm reporting User:Calton for incivility on the ANI board. 76.87.47.110 (talk) 06:12, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm, looks like your "anonymous friend" got blocked -- again -- this time for six months. Looks like you'll have to buy your own doughnuts.

Now, what was this about "desperate editor" and "classic online pathology"? Boy, that sounds like incivility to me -- or possibly aimed in the wrong direction. Is this name-calling a privilege you're reserving for yourself? --Calton | Talk 11:23, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmmmm, looks like you've concluded I've been falsely accused of being a sock puppet of 76.87.47.110 (talk · contribs · WHOIS)--Krispy Kreme please. Boodlesthecat (talk) 14:03, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmm, reading, not your strong suit it appears. Note -- perhaps you missed the subtlety -- that I put "anonymous friend" within quotation marks. You even missed the plain English of my "I'm not buying you doughnuts". That's a George W. Bush-level of pretending not to hear things people tell you.

But even, for the sake of argument, assuming you're not a sockpuppet, it still means that you allied yourself with an obsessive, indefinitely banned, factually wrong self-promoter -- great company to keep, what? -- and now your support is gone. Note that the admins laughed at her claims and bounced her out of her toot suite. Something to keep in mind if you keep trying the same tactics. --Calton | Talk 14:14, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

OK, enough of your insulting drivel. A) I'm not their sock puppet, so an APOLOGY, not insults is in order, and B) I hadn't "allied" myself with anybody; I was trying to balance the hostile, disruptive and guideline flaunting edits of an editor with a serious grudge against the very subject he's editing that you have allied yourself with. An editor who lies about my edit history, makes paranoid accusations, distorts edit history discussions, insists that his POV trumps reliable sourcing (see Matt Gonzalez article), and deletes other editors talk page comments that throw him in an unfavorable light. I can "Diff" all of this. So if you're not going to give me an apology and my donut, then go away and come back when you learn how to play nicely. Boodlesthecat (talk) 19:08, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You owe me an apology - Nope. You still, as I pointed out above, were carrying water from a banned troll. Talking about other people's behavior doesn't change that.

I hadn't "allied" myself with anybody - That would be factually incorrect, considering the exchanges of "me too!" with her when you were both forum-shopping.

An editor who lies about my edit history, makes paranoid accusations, distorts edit history discussions, insists that [her] POV trumps reliable sourcing ... and deletes other editors talk page comments that throw [her] in an unfavorable light. - fixed that for you. Oh, you weren't talking about J-M Spicuzza? I particularly liked her backwards causality, whereupon I supposed to have posted to WP:AN/I in revenge for something that hadn't yet happened.

OK, enough of your insulting drivel. - You first. As you sow, so shall ye reap, and the condescension that appears to be your default mode of interaction is insulting enough.

And what IS your bizarre fixation on doughnuts? Are you looking some form of external approval? Too cheap to buy your own? --Calton | Talk 22:00, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Calton, you seem to suffer the same penchant for distortion as your now- busted buddy Griot. What I "mee too'ed" were the contentions that Griot was using sock puppets. Oh, and looky (below) I was right. And no, I wasn't talking about J-M Spicuzza, whoever that is. All I know was the anon IP who accused Griot correctly of sock puppetry and other unkind things. so again, apologize and/or donut, or begone. Boodlesthecat (talk) 22:09, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You really need stronger evidence than "Because I said so," guy. --Calton | Talk 14:16, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Oh dear, somebody isn't following their own ground rules. Tsk. Boodlesthecat (talk) 15:25, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Griots #RR evading sock puppet has been confirmed here. Guess he was confused when he denied it here? It's not because I said so, its because checkuser said so. So why don't you go and abuse them instead of me, "guy?" Boodlesthecat (talk) 21:34, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It's a little confusing to me how you figured all this stuff out but you should absolutely check the Chris Daly page and Gavin Newsom page. Also check my talk page for a ridiciulous situation I had with him. --BillyTFried (talk) 22:12, 10 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Boodles. There seems to be some confusion or suspicion that you and I are actually the same user. If anybody should want to reach me to clarify that we are not the same person, I can be reached via email at [email protected]Marynega (talk) 18:27, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yea, they confused. Boodlesthecat (talk) 18:46, 8 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This is just FYI as it might not exactly address the discussion at Talk:Ralph_Nader#Naders_.22very_controversial.22_campaigns, but I see that Wikipedia:WTA#Scandal.2C_controversy.2C_affair lists "scandal" as a deprecated term and suggests "controversial episode" or "controversy" instead -- apparently the sense of editors of this style guideline is that "controversy" and "controversial" should not be considered pejorative. Have a good one. -- Writtenonsand (talk) 13:51, 9 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please see Wikipedia's no personal attacks and civility policies. Comment on content, not on contributors. Personal attacks damage the community and deter users, and even if you feel an editor has taken an action or actions which you disagree with or believe are wrong, acting as you have on User talk:Griot is completely unacceptable. Note that continued personal attacks will lead to blocks for disruption. Please stay cool and keep this in mind while editing. Orderinchaos 06:07, 10 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You recently compiled and listed a case at request for checkuser. A checkuser or clerk has asked that you list the code letter which matches with the violations of policy, which is listed at the top of the request for checkuser page. This has been implemented to reduce difficulties for checkusers, and is essential for your case to be processed in a timely manner. A link to your recently-created case which has this information missing is here. Thanks for your co-operation. AGK (talk) 22:15, 10 February 2008 (UTC), checkuser clerk.[reply]

Which is not allowed on Wikipedia talk pages, so all I did was revert it back to the original conversation. This can be seen here along with my comments on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Griot&action=history

AGAIN

He has done it again, saying (this is my talk page) - http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Griot&diff=prev&oldid=190710037<br\>

However Wikipedia talk pages are not the place for purposefully misrepresenting fellow editors in a bad light.<br\>

WP:Talk_page states that Article talk pages are provided for discussion of the content of articles and the views of reliable published sources. They should not be used by editors as platforms for their personal views.<br\>

And I am certain they are also not meant to be used in the way Griot is using his. Please have him either remove all conversations between me and him from his talk page or leave the whole conversation exactly as it originally was. If you are not an Admin or cannot handle this for me can you please direct me to someone who can. Thanks. BillyTFried (talk) 21:47, 11 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I can't have him do anything, I'm just another editor. I do chase mice rather well though. What you can do, if you feel there is abuse going on, is go to the Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents and post there, in accordance with the instructions there. In the meantime, it's no doubt best to stay off that editor's talk page. Refer to the Talk Page guidelines both to assess whether this editor is abusing their talk page and as a guide for what you can and can't do on their talk page. Meow. Boodlesthecat (talk) 22:27, 11 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, that's what I did: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents#Griot_deliberately_misrepresenting_me_on_his_talk_page<br\> Thanks for the advice! --BillyTFried (talk) 22:41, 11 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. You might find this interesting: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Griot&diff=prev&oldid=190675197<br\> BillyTFried (talk) 23:39, 11 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the rib tickler. Dlabtot (talk) 22:30, 14 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Boodles, I agree with your edit here. Don't get me wrong, I'm trying to work "incrementally", perhaps too much so. WNDL42 (talk) 18:10, 19 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Frackin' brilliant! I like the way you communicate BtC..:) While you're at it, I'd like a side of spam with my quantum mystical pseudoscientific bleepin' dead parrot, eh, squire? Dreadstar † 23:47, 14 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

		The Barnstar of Good Humor
		For your Heroically Humorous efforts to get the message across...! Keep up the good humor! Dreadstar † 23:54, 14 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

image:SpockVulcan.jpg

Likely by now you are aware that once again your suspicions have been confirmed and once again Griot has been indefinitely blocked. Whatever may come of this now, I'd just like to let you know that I appreciate your sleuthing and persistence. Not all disruption to Wikipedia takes the form of blatant vandalism, and we need people who are willing to doggedly pursue less obvious instances as well. As I mentioned when you first approached me on my talk page about this, I had (and still have) very little familiarity with sock puppetry and the pursuit thereof, but my observation of your experience suggests that it can be a challenging task. Thanks for being willing to take it on anyway. --Moonriddengirl ^(talk) 15:18, 19 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks from me too....WNDL42 (talk) 17:52, 19 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hey Griot, aren't you banned indefinitely? Found another sock in the drawer?

Say, isn't your own pet abusive sockpuppeteer banned, too? Seems to me Griot has a long way to go to match your friend in total number of socks squashed.

But let me guess: abuse in a good cause is always right: nice to see you've made clear that you've adopted Republican Party Values, then. --Calton | Talk 13:48, 21 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I will continue to remove poor grammar and unencycopedic language. Ask for help if you can't figure out how to say something properly. Rracecarr (talk) 18:52, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

How 'bout your wholesale revert without consensus of Rationalist's improvements to the lead?? Rracecarr (talk) 18:54, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

How about his wholesale rewrite without concensus? And what does that have to do with your rude behavior? Boodlesthecat (talk) 18:58, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It has to do with you complaining about removing material. Pots and kettles, and all that. Rracecarr (talk) 19:01, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

seriously, man, you're making no sense, you are being rude, combative, uncivil, and flagrantly edit warring. Kindly desist. Boodlesthecat (talk)

"Challenges how" and "attributes to how" are not appropriate. A start would be changing "how" to "the way in which". Also, you are past 3RR, just to let you know. Rracecarr (talk) 19:20, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Your a nit-picking simply for POV pushing purposes. End of discussion since you are not being honest. Boodlesthecat (talk) 19:25, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am honest, and it is uncivil of you to assume bad faith. I don't particularly see the phrases as POV (although they do add clutter), just really bad writing. Rracecarr (talk) 19:54, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No you are using "grammar" and rude assertions about "really bad writing" to delete sourced, factual content you don't like. It's all in the history, so please stop cluttering my talk page with your disingenous arguments. Boodlesthecat (talk) 20:20, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi Boodlesthecat, I have had a terrible time with Rracecarr reverting, undoing and deleting my work at several different articles; most notable the foot-pound force article. I have for the last 9 months tried to communicate with Rracecarr in a civil manner. However Rracecarr's responses are off topic or non-sequitur's with sarcastic language (that puts it nicely). Rracecarr's posts read like this is some kind of competition. I find it weird. The edit warring that Rracecarr is engaged in borders on juvenile behavior. I would report his/her behavior to admin but one, I don't know how and two, that is an extreme measure. Do you have any suggetions for me? Thank you, Greg Glover (talk) 22:36, 23 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

greg--as you can see above, I don't think I was very successful in my interactions with Rracecarr. I'm not sure what gets him going into that mode, but I also see on your talk page that there is within it all some productive discussion. Since you are discussing technical definitional issues, I think perhaps maybe you two can agree to hammer out specific differences, and agree on mutually acceptable definitions and expository wordings. The issues seem to be regarding technical matters, so you can both consult the proper published reference works for guidance where there are disagreements. If there are issues about popular usage, eg., torgue, that can be worked into the article ("in some contexts, torque can refer to...) just like the complex number article notes "In some disciplines (in particular, electrical engineering, where i is a symbol for current), the imaginary unit i is instead written as j, so complex numbers are sometimes written as a + jb" so that an engineer doesnt throw a fit and say :"no, it's written j!!" In any case, have a chat and see if you can agree to hammer out differences on talk pages (wheere others may have input too), consult authorities and then make agreed upon edits, rather than back and forth. Hope this is useful! Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:20, 24 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you so much. Your examples are great. I think this will be very helpful.Greg Glover (talk) 13:07, 24 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Boodles, comments [like this] really don't do anyone any favours. Please watch for civility, Jefffire (talk) 17:14, 21 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I had hoped you would have taken this in a mature fashion. Consider this your warning for uncivil behavior. Anything else and you will be reported for disruption. Jefffire (talk) 22:31, 21 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Using threats of reporting as a cheap intimidation attempt....yawn Boodlesthecat (talk) 22:49, 21 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please do stop this behavior. Jefffire (talk) 22:58, 21 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Jeffire, You've threatened me similarly and it's getting old. The behavior Boodles is commenting on is far more disruptive, and any "civility" issues should be addressed at the root of the problem. The user Boodles is commenting on is way out of line, throwing up Smoke screens, and I personally find it to be disruptive. If Boodles "socratic irony" is what it takes, well that's unfortunate, but it's better than locking the article over and over again, which is what we had before. WNDL42 (talk) 00:25, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please do not attack other editors. If you continue, you will be blocked from editing Wikipedia. Personal attacks, such as calling others Nazi's, is strongly discouraged and flat-out inappropriate despite the context. seicer | talk | contribs 00:27, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Seriously, stop your bickering. It's getting tiring. Will ^(talk) 00:46, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Same shit, different day. Stop it. Will ^(talk) 00:50, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I can understand and somewhat relate to your feelings, but if you continue, you will be blocked, I'm sorry to say. Having an opinion about something doesn't get your blocked from here; attacking others about their opinions will. ~ Riana ⁂ 01:12, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Tell me you are kidding. anti-Semitic rants and Jew-baiting of other editors is permitted on wikipedia?? Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:14, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, and that user may be facing a block too. But you need to calm down, please. ~ Riana ⁂ 01:16, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am perfectly calm and waiting for someone to address this users vicious anti-Semitism rather than attack me for bringing it to Wikipedia's attention. I bring it up and get told to "shut the hell up?" Is that how thing s work here?Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:19, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I appreciate that you are upset at his strange views regarding Jews and Judaism, but calling someone a Nazi is never acceptable. Nazis are something entirely different from bizarrely anti-Semitic contributors at Wikipedia and Stormfront. The best policy in a situation like this is to ignore anti-Semites, keep a watch on your articles to make sure they aren't dumped down the Looking Glass and report specific policy violations (like 3RR, etc.) when you see them. (And before you accuse me of having an agenda towards ignoring this sort of complaint, have a look at my userpage). Avruch ^T 01:57, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I understand; even though that editor is a member of a Nazi forum (Stormfront) I wont call a spade a spade and call him a Nazi. Fine. Now--is there no policy about filling talk pages with anti-Semitic rants? seems like a no-no per WP:talk. How come no one will address that, and that editors Jew baiting me, and only respond with the rather bizarre notion that I shoudlnt call a nazi a nazi? Boodlesthecat (talk) 02:05, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There aren't any Nazis at the moment, and hopefully there never will be again. Stormfront is a collection of losers who whine about how the world mistreats them, and blame it on targets conveniently picked out for them by history. Calling them Nazis either gives them far more credit (in their world) than they deserve, or demeans those who suffered and died at the hands of actual Nazis. There are methods for dealing with anti-Semitic hatred on talkpages. First, don't violate any policies yourself. Second, accumulate a body of evidence that includes the most egregious diffs. Once you have, post it in one go to AN/I or start an RfC. Avruch ^T 02:10, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I posted on ANI links to a page full of anti-semitic rants by this member of a collection of losers who whine about how the world mistreats them, and was told to "shut the hell up." Boodlesthecat (talk) 02:12, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well, the problem with that (not that I'm condoning shut the hell up, but perhaps Will knows more background than I do) is that when you make a report on AN/I, typically it is much more helpful to provide a list of diffs to violations so that it can be reviewed quickly without someone having to devote a great deal of time to filling themselves in or reading over a page filled with bullshit. If you want to assemble a list of diffs and repost later, or at AN instead of AN/I, you could do that. I'd recommend at least ten different diffs, with the most objectionable text displaying in the link in your report. Avruch ^T 02:15, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No actually Will knew nothing of the background, but instead chose to give a perfect exampe of a violation of WP:DIK. A courteous response, by any editor or admin on my AN/I would be to simply and cordially request examples, which I would happily supply, rather than lambast me for complaining about being the target of an anti-Semitic loser. Boodlesthecat (talk) 02:26, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Since the WP:ANI board indicates that the matter is closed, I put a note at the Wikiquette page about the archive. It is not productive to have the archive remain on the talk page (along with most of the other sections) and your diffs still work (which are much better than links to the current version anyway). If the Wikiquette board gives you the same result, I would strongly suggest you simply leave it alone. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 04:16, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There is a consensus between the article talk page, your user talk page, the editor telling you not to forum shop, and myself. If anyone else was interested in getting involved, they could chose to reopen the section (and that's quite common). Between all those individuals, it seems clear to me. I've repeated this at Wikiquette. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 04:31, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, and sorry if I didn't say this earlier, but feel free to pull the section out of the archive if you actually believe there is something there to discuss. I would disagree, but I think it would be better if I stayed uninvolved. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 10:33, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Julian Barbour indeed! Have you checked out Jacob Bekenstein, John Archibald Wheeler and/or Holographic Principle? See especially the last. Bleep discussions get old...but remain important because new users come in, start identifying with the cult of "pathological disbelief" and (as innocent bystanders) get sucked in to this garbage. Very tiresome, but it's an unfortunately pervasive problem on Wikipedia. WNDL42 (talk) 16:49, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Bekenstein is Wheeler's student and developed the Generalized Second Law... WNDL42 (talk) 17:05, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please report abuse to WP:ANI. Thanks, --Shirahadasha (talk) 17:25, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Given that the material is in the archive, you probably shouldn't revert the most recent removal. You can just point to the archive or to an earlier version of the talk page. - Jmabel | Talk 21:42, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

hi--See above; Ricky81682, who did the archiving in the midst of the Wikiquette filing, has instructed me to feel free to unarchive. archiving makes the links to the full relevant sections inoperable. I think we can wait until a resolution on this--it certainly seems like a bit of impropriety to archive precidely in the middle of an active dispute about the material. Per Ricky81682's post above, I am going to revert. Boodlesthecat (talk) 21:52, 25 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I understand you may be angry but do you really think your current posts on AN/I are helping your case? In fact, you carry on this way and it's likely you'll get blocked too. You should either calm a bit or expect uninvolved users to take your comments with less weight. David D. (Talk) 06:24, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Seriously ... your comments are getting to be over the top. You need to tone it down several notches and I would strongly suggest disengaging with the other user if/when he becomes unblocked and let others handle him. --B (talk) 06:36, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Boodles, I appreciate your acceptance and concerns about my posts to the talk page, and in thinking about how to reply decided that repeating your post, and my reply here, was appropriate. Active discussion seems to have slowed considerably over the week end.

Those excerpts illustrate some of the complexities of the era, with Jewish lobbying power beginning to flex its strength and taking head-on a political establishment that was indifferent to Jews at best and contained a not so subtle anti-Semitic current (as seen in those now famous Truman quotes). This all is in the context of the aftermath of the tragic and unconscionable failures of the New Deal regime to act on behalf of Jews in the Hitler era. Now the Lobby is flexing its muscle and coming head to head with Cold War realpolitic. The anti-Semitic undercurrent continued well into recent years, peaking of course with the Jew hater Nixon.

Please allow me a re-write of it, to illustrate how I believe it should fit into the article, and to some extent, how it fits my bias.

These excerpts illustrate the strength and some of the complexities of this critical pre-state era, with both Zionist and Jewish lobbying power beginning to exercise its strength by taking head-on a gentile political establishment that was indifferent to Jews as it should be (domestically) in a proportional democracy. This all is in the context of the aftermath and guilt of the tragic and unconscionable failures of the wartime and postwar administration to act on behalf of Jews in the Hitler era. [This should go in the article, as appropriately worded and re-worded, as the article is edited. The specific lobbying role of some Jews and Zionists to save European Jews during this period is also appropriate.]

That American society includes a not so subtle but limited anti-Semitic current, largely the result of other previous unrelated historical facts and misconceptions, is a fact. The anti-Semitic and newer New anti-Semitism and self hating Jew undercurrent continues to the present, peaking following the 1967 and 1973 wars, in the 1978 and 1982 Lebanon invasions, 1987 first intifada, 2000 second intifada, and the 2006 Lebanon invasion. Currently the lobby is flexing its muscle and coming head to head with post-Cold War realpolitic, where more (M&W) point out that this is not good for America. The Jew hater Nixon, I believe, can be shown to be another example of lobby power and domestic political expediency overruling his personal feelings and American interests. [How this is worked into the article, requires considerably more discussion, I believe.]

As seen in those now famous Truman quotes, there is legitimate moral concern that “The action of some of our United States Zionists [and now also, the post-77 Likud-dominated governments] will prejudice everyone against what they are trying to get done.”

This is certainly my bias. If you are concerned how I might use these, please see this dif [1] as to how I incorporated the first Lenczowski excerpt into an appropriate existing article. I do understand that different articles require different quotes; I hope it is acceptable. Regards, CasualObserver'48 (talk) 06:37, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have blocked you for 24 hours for harassment and disruption. Specifically, for continuing to insinuate that the admins and editors discussing this issue at AN/I are challenging you out of some latent or patent antisemitism, even after being asked, by multiple parties, to stop. The next block for this sort of behavior will be longer. Regards, Nandesuka (talk) 15:53, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I was blocked for harrassment and disruption

• There is nothing indicating anyone being harrassed, per the descriptions given in WP:HAR
• The claim of "disruption" is one-sided and removes the relevant history of how this became a dispute. I have caused no disruption--I have responded to them, as will be outlined
• The origins of this dispute are in the complaints, since verified, of longstanding racist ranting and anti-Semitic personal attacks by EliasAlucard. That was the first disruption that I responded too, as this editor's rants were a constant disruption of the editing process and his dispicable rants were a flarant violation of WP:TALK
• I filed a complaint at WP:ANI and was told to "shut the hell up" by an editor who then archived the case.
• I filed a new complaint at WP:WQA here documenting the racist rants, and Jew baiting personal attacks by EliasAlucard. There I was falsely told by Ricky81682 that there was "consensus" on WQA to "let it go, even though all there was on WQA was the "shut the hell up" comment" and more rants by EliasAlucard. This complaint at least resulted in some recognition of the problem with this anti-Semite, and a warning to him. Boodlesthecat (talk) 19:05, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• When EliasAlucard continued his disruptive editing and racial/anti-Semitic taunting, including characterizing the Holocaust as the "Holohoax," I filed another WP:ANI documenting EliasAlucard's continued violations. ultimately this resulted in corroboration once again, and a 3 day block of the racist editor. However, in the course of what should havee beena simple case, given the glaring evidence against EliasAlucard, there were disruptions by other editors and harrassment of me in the course of that filing. Among other things I was
  • "basically attacking him (EliasAlucard) non-stop for quite some time now" with no evidence presented of my "attacks" and in complete disregard of the endless racial taunting I had endured
  • Told that my complaints against this vile racist "looks like a bit of a hit-job, designed to get him blocked for disagreeing" This "blaming the victim is where I questioned why it was that I was being charged with orchestrating a conspiracy ("hit job") against a clearly racist, anti-Semitic editor. Bringing up the latent anti-Semitic undertones in that accusation is not "harrassment--if anything, the contention that I was somehow conspiring against this editor is harrassment.
  • Challenged about my complaint about the use of "Holohoax", when it was quite clear to anyone taking a moment to read that it was being used in a noxious manner by EliasAlucard (and which is now agreed)
  • Told that I was somehow violating EliasAlucard's "free speech", when {WP:TALK]]'s first, bold faced advice is Article talk pages should not be used by editors as platforms for their personal views. I questioned if somehow anti-Semitic rants were an exception to this rule, since I was being told I was somehow impinging upon the anti-Semtic editor's rights and free speech. I still question that.
  • was told by user Will AGAIN to "shut the hell up: Can you read, Boodles? This is getting ridiculous. I told you in no uncertain terms to shut up and take the dispute off the wiki about 30 hours ago Bizarre complaint about forum shopping, since his first obnoxious rejection is what made it necessary. Will has yet to receive any serious actions against him for his nasty personal attacks and flagrant msiuse of WP:ANI, just some pointless wrist slapping.
  • Was told by Veritas that I "dragged most of AN/I into your personal feud" as if I am somehow responsible for what they posted, and as if my response to anti-Semitic attacks was "my personal" issue, rather than one that should concern the Wiki community. All they needed to do, if they wished, was to review the evidence and comment. Instead, some felt the need to attack and attempt to discredit me, if not outright defend a vile anti-Semite and racist.

• On the basis of the above, and more, I request an unblock. I will be happy to tone down my commentary; I do, however, feel that it would be fair if there was at least an acknowledgment of the (at the miniumum) equal amount of "disruption and harrassment" I have been subjected to. Cheers Boodlesthecat (talk) 19:05, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'd support an unblock based on the unproductive comments from Will. Given that kind of provocation it would be hard for anyone to remain calm. This would be subject to this being a lesson to proceed with such complaints in a rationale and productive way despite users like Will. When uninvolved users ask questions for clarification assume things might not be clear. A measured calm debate will also be more successful than getting frustrated. David D. (Talk) 19:13, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed to proceed rationally and productively (although such things as accusations of orchestrating a "hit job" against an anti Semite seemed a bit beyond a request for clarification!). Boodlesthecat (talk) 19:27, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That user did apologise for that comment when you brought it up. Things don't always have to go from bad to worse. I asked Nandesuka to consider unblocking you. David D. (Talk) 19:45, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Can someone perhaps help clarify what this comment and this not very clarifying clarification might possibly mean, since I cannot currently inquire directly? I certainly don;t want to make any assumptions, and would definitely like some second opinions/interpretations. Thanks! Boodlesthecat (talk) 20:00, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Any clues? Boodlesthecat (talk) 22:55, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

OK, WebHamster did clarify what he meant, which is, judging from the he supplied as explanation is that I am impersonating the perfect whiny neurotic jew. So upon expiration of my block that came as a result of protesting anti-Semitic rants on Wikipedia, I will be filing a complaint against WebHamster first thing for his nasty little anti-Semitic slur against me. I am really baffled as to what goes through the minds of some editors here. Boodlesthecat (talk) 23:39, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

While it may be that I have missed some particularly inflammatory post you made, I consider your block well out of bounds. The nearest practical effect I could see it having would be to discourage users from reporting bias, and further discourage users from criticising admin comments. This block is just depressing. That's all I can think to say. IronDuke 23:47, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, IronDuke I share your concerns about discouraging users. I don't know if I posted anything inflammatory, but I certainly did get visibly pissed about having to be subjected to a barrage of anti-Semitism, and then to get criticized and even attacked ("shut the hell up!") for reporting it. In any case, it won't be discouraging me--as I noted above, first thing on TO DO list after the block is over is to report the nasty, gratuitous anti-Semitic attack by WebHamster above. Hey who knows--maybe someone will even do it on my behalf in the interim. Boodlesthecat (talk) 23:57, 26 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for reporting the user in the first place. I'm wondering if an RfC might be the way to go. But after seeing some of the truly disheartening stuff on AN/I, I'm having second thoughts. IronDuke 00:01, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

How long will WebHamster be allowed to continue his vicious anti-Semitic tirade against me (as he is doing right now) before someone threatens to block him, blocks him, or tells him (as i was told for protesting anti-Semitism) "shut the hell up?" Boodlesthecat (talk) 00:10, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Since you're so fond of links, here's one for you: You've been treating Wikipedia as if were your personal Fight Club to carry on your off-wiki political warfare, enforce your own specific politics, and to harass anyone you perceive as an "enemy" -- the last even to the point of condoning and aiding a long-banned and abusive sockpuppeteer so you can proclaim your own fight against a sockpuppeteer, one who seems to have been driven to it, in part, by your abusive behavior. "Hypocrisy" may not be strong enough a word for it.

As for your paranoid and authoritarian "warning" on my page: 1) I read and comment on WP:AN/I and WP:AN all the time -- the last time I checked, I had 505 edits to WP:AN/I and 299 to WP:AN -- so the part about "following" is pure nonsense. In fact, given that you've gone and commented about comments left by others on my Talk Page, I'd say any "following" is going on in a different direction. 2) Having you reach for WP:NPA -- that handy, all-purpose shield against criticism -- in the SAME posting as "your personal, irrational, and childish grudge"[2] shows a fundamental lack of understanding of the policy you're claiming to cite. 3) You're in no position -- legal, assigned, managerial, ethical, or even moral -- to be giving out warnings -- first or final -- on other users's behavior. None. Going by the block above, perhaps the opposite.

Given all the contradictions between your strident claims and your actual behavior, I'd say that this page might be helpful reading for you. --Calton | Talk 00:44, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Just to be fair, Calton, you have until my block is over to provide evidence of my

• "condoning and aiding a long-banned and abusive sockpuppeteer"
• "using wiki to carry on my off-wiki political warfare"
• How a serial sock puppeteer whose began his puppet career over a year before I ever edited opposite him "was driven to it, in part, by my abusive behavior."

as well as apologize for that convoluted and largely incomprehensible rant you just spewed above, or you will be #2 on the complaint list after WebHamster. I'm starting to feel like a freak magnet. Boodlesthecat (talk) 00:52, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well, if your edit summaries are like, "Is every freak [...]," then yes. seicer | talk | contribs 00:55, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

"Edit summaries should accurately and succinctly summarize the nature of the edit." Didn't know they had prognostic properties as well! Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:11, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

i'm still blocked for being such a mean mean meanie to this lovable fella. Hehe hehe, zat's a hoot! Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:25, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

boodlesthecat, I think you realise you have support, but don't push it with this new section. Just be glad you won the day with minimal damage. David D. (Talk) 01:38, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, guess i got a little bored stuck in my cage while all the other kids get to play :). Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:40, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, may be you could read a book? There is life outside the computer :) Besides it's not that long to wait. David D. (Talk) 01:46, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

no can't read a book--they don't like us doing that at work :) Boodlesthecat (talk) 01:48, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I see what you mean. I'm not going to be around much for the next few days, but I'll help out when I have some time.

In the meantime, you might get some support at WP:BLP/N. The editors there have stepped into a couple of edit wars over BLPs and cut out WP:OR, WP:SYNTH, and other slanted material. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 05:03, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Glad to help and glad you thought I did help. I need to take another look at the article, too. It's understandable that some material would be hard to find - it may be better to look for the topic in books or journals, as I'm sure the case has been reviewed, both near the time and later, for what it seemed to represent about race issues - which also changed over time with the investigation and conclusions of the grand jury, etc.--Parkwells (talk) 14:44, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have blocked you for 48 hours for this edit, in the context of your being repeatedly warned -- and blocked -- for insinuating antisemitic motives to other editors simply because they disagree with you. Your comments are a slur on Cla68. If you immediately apologize to him, I will consider unblocking you.

If you instead decide to continue a campaign of incivility on this talk page, I will protect it. Your behavior is unacceptable. You will moderate it. Nandesuka (talk) 05:54, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I endure days of attacks, abuse, nastiness and incivility and an anti-Semitic personal attack (all because I had the audacity to bring to the attention of this community a vile disruptive anti-Semite) which gets ignored, yet when I respond to someone who is accusing me of "baiting" this vile racist, I get blocked--again! This double standard is ridiculous--I have endured reams of attacks, countless (as you call them speculative "insinuating" about my "motives" on every noticeboard discussing this racist that I--and none of you--dealt with. All for what? Sanctions, blocks, anti-Semitic innuendo? Sorry, Nandesuka, I'll take the 48 hours. I can't in good conscience accept your offer. Boodlesthecat (talk) 06:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• I have endured days of insinuations, abuse, personal attacks, incivilities, accusations, as if I'm some sort of punching bag on boards all over Wikipedia discussing the case of the racist holocaust denier Elias Alucard (who I brought to the attention of the community). Yet my every syllable is microscrutinized, with admins lining up waiting to pounce within seconds and throw blocks my way--especially Nandesuka, who this time acted within 45 seconds. This is an absurd witchhunt--all because I exposed an actual disruptive, vile character (who a disturbing number of editors are actually defending.) This is Kafkaesque. Boodlesthecat (talk) 06:13, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Your bad behavior does not excuse anyone else's bad behavior. No one else's bad behavior excuses yours. We are all, in the end, responsible for our own choices. I am sorry that you had to endure suffering at the hands of Elias or other editors. That makes it all the sadder that you see fit to inflict similar indignities on others. I hope you change your mind about not apologizing, but in the end the choice is yours. Nandesuka (talk) 06:16, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, Nandesuka, obviously the choice is yours. Like Cla68 (who actully owes me an apology) you ascribe to me some magical mind control powers that force people to act as they do. Just take responsibility for your own actions thank you, and I for mine--but please don;t insult me by insinuating that i am forcing you to stalk my every syllable and pounce within seconds. And your insinuation that my actions ("indignities") are anywhere comparable to a vicious, Jew hating, racist is beyond insulting. I'd like an apology for that. It's smacks of Alucard's "Jews are the real Nazis" slander. Boodlesthecat (talk) 06:25, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Since you are unable to resist insinuating antisemitic motives to yet another editor -- this time, me -- I am protecting your talk page for the duration of your block. Normally I would revert egregious abuse such as your last message, but in this particular case I want any reviewing admins to understand why I felt this step was necessary. Nandesuka (talk) 07:37, 28 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

In case you wouldn't see my response above:: Glad to help and glad you thought I did help. I need to take another look at the article, too. It's understandable that some material would be hard to find - it may be better to look for coverage of the topic in books or journals, as I'm sure the case has been reviewed, both near the time and later, for what it seemed to represent about race issues - opinions of which also changed over time with the investigation and conclusions of the grand jury, etc.--Parkwells (talk) 14:44, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well Boodles .... thanks for your input on the Bleep article . I also am wondering why I continue to try and make things work over there. Thanks for you great sense of humour and steady awareness of policy.I've tried everything to bring some kind of focus so that we can at least move on but today all I got was insulted so have to think seriously about continuing. Anyway love your sense of humour, and a picture is worth ....(olive (talk) 19:39, 2 March 2008 (UTC))[reply]

I'm sorry to see that you are leaving Bleep . We really need as many people as possible who know and understand policy over there. I'm not sure how the article can ever progress. Anyway your light was big and I'm sorry it will be "out" on Bleep.(olive (talk) 23:18, 2 March 2008 (UTC))[reply]

I think there is an explanation in this new study on about wikipedia, note the relative lack of coverage on WP in literature vs. geeky stuff. I think Wikipedians' behavior is a general reflection on the aesthetic sensibilities of it's dominant editor mindset. Boodles, you are a brilliant humorist and always on the mark, please drop by Bleep once in awhile and don't let the scientistic's get to you... WNDL42 (talk) 04:04, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have to ask, I looked at the figures (especially figure 3) in that article and it didn't seem to show a relative lack of coverage on WP in literature vs. geeky stuff. How did you come to this conclusion? David D. (Talk) 06:18, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi David. I was looking at Fig. 1, page 432 of the Journal (which is pdf page 4), specifically at x-axis categories "B", "L", and (especially) "P" (literature), on which topic Wikipedia reflects less that half of what the outside world in general reflects. Thanks for asking...is there a talk page somewhere where we can discuss further? WNDL42 (talk) 14:59, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You might want to look here. I don't know if it's discussion about the articles themselves, or about listing the articles. Boodlesthecat (talk) 15:16, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I saw figure one but was not sure how to interpret that. The problem is that literature is inherently about publishing books. So it should be no surprise that the number of literature articles is down compared to the real world number of books. History is way up, is that more geeky or more like literature?

I the active number of edits per page, which was similar, seems to be a more accurate reflection of tha activity on wikipedia, or vandalism :) Especially given there are roughly the same number of literature 10% vs science 13% articles in the set they studied. David D. (Talk) 16:03, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, you present a valid alternative hypothesis. I for one am working now on a different topic, and I could use some help. David, Olive and (especially) Boodles, can you look at a new article I just created on "Lzip". It's critically important that this article be in shape for nomination as a "feature article" on or before the first of next month. I hope you will join me in this monumentally important event in the ongoing evolution and refinement of Wiki-culture. WNDL42 (talk) 16:56, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Can you come back to here if you have the time or interest please. I need to get some more views on what I think continues to be a complex case of conflict of interest by this editor - and whether this should just got to the Wikipedia Foundation now rather than us trying to deliberate it further. Thank you.--VS ^talk 10:34, 4 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I understand that Calton has been harassing you, along with a number of other users. I would like to file a joint complaint with the arbitration committee against him, as he is clearly abusing other users and repeatedly violating the rule against personal attacks. Please join me in this important effort to help clean up wikipedia. Lirath Q. Pynnor (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 19:35, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I understand how the system works, or rather, how it doesn't work; what I'm suggesting is that we file a joint-complaint, with both of our names on it, and perhaps the names of some other people we can find since Calton seems to have been harassing quite a few people. It'll be harder for them to simply ignore a request with multiple complaintants. I also suggest you join the review which is a good [censored] forum for discussion of Wikipedia's inherent flaws. Lirath Q. Pynnor (talk)

I noticed that your user page has been vandalized and blanked; with your permission, I would like to revert it to your previous edit, as you do not deserve to be victimized by such unwarranted censorship. Lirath Q. Pynnor (talk)

I'm amazed at how 'special' some of these darling little admins are; its like they have nothing better to do with their life than try to decide whether putting booooooooooooooodles on your user page is appropriate or not. I suggested to Calton that he might be more productive if he started a collection of lint. Lirath Q. Pynnor (talk)

Duke once wore a Nazi suit when he was a teenager and has never been part of a Neo-Nazi organization. That hardly warrants mentioning him in the opening paragraph as if he were a major proponent of the ideology. Also, he has renounced Nazism several times, including in his book -My awakening- and has compared Israel to Nazi Germany when he has strong feelings of antipathy for Israel which suggests antipathy for Nazi Germany as well. --Spitzer19 (talk) 21:11, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please refrain from undoing other people's edits repeatedly. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing Wikipedia. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions in a content dispute within a 24 hour period. Additionally, users who perform a large number of reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring, even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. Rather than reverting, discuss disputed changes on the talk page. The revision you want is not going to be implemented by edit warring. Thank you. ·:· Will Beback ·:· 02:49, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

On the face of it the page you mentioned appears to be a case of sockputtetry and as such a breach of 3RR. It appears a bit to coincidental that the users and IPs spring up with very smiilar edit summaries as well. I've made a comment similar to this on Will Beback's page. BigHairRef | Talk 04:43, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I would suggest you await the result of the checkuser, whilst I don't have a problem with being on your side as far as 3RR is concerned, given that I don't have access to the textbook cited I'd be hesitant to include it per WP:BIO, at least for now. Taking neither side I'd let the IP have this one for now as I'd be unwilling to continue to revert based on vandalism as it's possible he may have a point, even if he's going about it wrongly. BigHairRef | Talk 04:50, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've seen the talk page but as I said it's a personal thing (for me), unless you've got some particularly compelling reason for nailing Duke to the wall (not that he needs any more anyway) I'd wait untill it's shown the IP is a sock. BigHairRef | Talk 05:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I've tagged the various puupes with my suspicions. If you want to include it in the checkuser or anything else that should be fine. I'm not going to keep an eye on the page tiself (Neo-Nazism) but I will be watching the various talk and user pages. BigHairRef | Talk 05:16, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think I'm your man for the last message you left me, I'm not an admin so I cant do anything about it, I'd suggest that wither using RfC or Mediation (personally for now I'd suggest the former) is now the best bet. AS s I said before I'm not going to keep an eye on the page itself, enough people already seem to be doing that, I will be watching various editors but no more. BigHairRef | Talk 21:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

For edit warring on on New Force (Italy), you have been blocked for a period of 24 hours. After the block expires, please attempt discussion before reverting. Any further reverts after the block will result in additional blocks of increasing duration. - auburnpilot talk 21:29, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I discussed how this user's edits constituted malicious POV pushing and false claims in detail here, and I ceased reverting and asked the offending editor and likely sock puppeteer to revert himself. Dont worry, I wont bother reverting if blocking admins can't take the time to review a situation and simply throw blocks around at people trying to keep POV pushing sock puppeteers and vandals from disrupting articles. Boodlesthecat (talk) 22:19, 7 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There are very specific exceptions to the three revert rule, all of which can be found within Wikipedia:3RR#Exceptions. Maintaining an article's neutral point of view is not one of those exceptions, as that is entirely related to content (one person's view of neutral is another person's political bias). While reverting a banned editor or a user evading a block is an exception, not a single one of the editors who you claim to be socks of the editor who you were reverting, have ever been blocked. In other words, your edits do not fall within the exceptions of the rule, and constitute edit warring regardless of the time frame. So before accusing people of placing blocks without reviewing a situation, assume some good faith, as I assure you I don't place blocks on a whim. - auburnpilot talk 00:04, 8 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The three revert rule always applies unless you are one of the people who gets to apply "ignore all rules". At that point, you can denounce "wikilawyering" and just ban anyone you want while endlessly reverting them. Sorry you didn't get the memo on that. Sometimes, in fact, you can get banned for violating the three-revert rule when it wasn't actually a revert; life is curious like that when you live in a [censored] society. Lirath Q. Pynnor (talk)

Good catch. I missed that one. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 22:31, 12 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Boodlesthecat. I have been looking at the complaint about Committee for Accuracy in Middle East Reporting in America that you filed at WP:COIN. Since I saw that this concerned the Middle East (a notorious venue of trouble and disputes that are impossible to resolve) I have been dreading having to analyze this one seriously. However, if there is going to be a serious discussion at COIN, probably you should try to add some diffs about the promotional edits. Otherwise people will just go ahead and regard this a 'political' issue about which nothing can be done. We need very specific evidence of violations if we expect to get admins to take it seriously. One option is to designate a specific set of COI-affected editors who we request not to touch the CAMERA article. That would certainly take a lot of evidence, since it most cases we don't have proof of COI, we just have the record of past edits that may be considered promotional in nature. Someone has to go and dig up those edits, if you expect the COIN report to get any traction with administrators. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 20:25, 19 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Boodles, I went to the trouble to write some thing at AN/I, but when I went back to check something, it was gone. Here is my post that will never get there (not yet fully ref'd/checked).

Whoa, hold it, get rid of the personal information. Deal with the ‘conflict of interest’ stuff where and how it is supposed to be dealt with. There are serious and provable issues here. To my mind, the guy has shot himself in the foot, out’d himself and further disgraced the organization in the process. I am an involved editor; independently I had noted some ‘socky’ things happening between Gni and the ‘68’ anon address. Had I seen CAMERA in the ‘Who-is’ that I checked (but didn’t do a page down), I would have been here sooner on my own; sorry I am late. My POV is different from Boodle’s, but our views of NPOV are similar.

Gni has unmitigated gall to be the first post here (except for the personal-info thing). He has committed serious Wiki-no-no for considerable time and over a broad range of subjects for one single purpose. Not all of his edits are invalid (that will take a very long time to check), but he should be censured/sanctioned/banned, whatever the wiki-word is. His most disingenuous comment however is, “And it should be clear to neutral observers, based on my edit history, that it is hardly my sole or primary purpose to promote a person, company, product, service or organization.”

Zealot, hypocrite and unsuitable POV-editor are the closest, most descriptive, yet civil, words that I can come up with. Yet, I can define Gni’s ‘single person, company, product, service or organization’ all in a single, hyphenated word. It is, in fact[] the specific word that he keeps trying to expunge from Wikipedia. The word is “pro-Israel”, and I will let CAMERA speak for itself, [3], because, frankly, it has nearly been impossible to NPOV it here.

Welcome to the Middle East, people. If editors here can not see the broader implications of the continuing POV’d offensive on the core values of what Wikipedia is supposed to be, then we are well past being characterized as ‘three blind men and an elephant.’ This is a specific case where Wikipedia could take a big step toward leveling the NPOV playing field concerning the I-P conflict. When incidents like this arise, especially at AN/I or similar lofty heights, I look to administrative editors to make honest, fair, but bold decisions to put a stop to it. Unfortunately and frankly, what I too often see is the ass-end of an ostrich, with its head in the NPOV sand. It must be a 'forest for the trees' kind of thing. Respectfully,

That he was able to start and finish that case's life on the page without one colon in his last post, seems very well designed, quite unfathomable, almost unbelievable. Regards, CasualObserver'48 (talk) 09:23, 21 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I know you haven't violated any policies and did the right thing bringing the issue to COIN. But this Gni fellow seems to have identified you as his enemy in this matter. Granted he hasn't been forthcoming in the matter, but I figure I'll give him some rope and see what he does with it. We all know precisly what an RFCU will come back as, and rather than it be a you v. him situation, I'd like to move it to several people (me, Ed, some Jewish-expert editors, and you) all upholding our principles and trying to show him its not a random feline (pardon pun, couldn't resist) who wants him to alter his style, but rather that the entire project insists on it. MBisanz ^talk 06:36, 26 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

And, just to predict how things will proceed. Tomorrow several Anon. IPs will begin editing the article to push the CAMERA POV. If you could come to me or Ed, I know I'll revert and protect the page for some time. Possibly the edits will be centered geographically enough that a CU can be brought in. We all know what we'll see, and I'll have to use the buttons. MBisanz ^talk 06:40, 26 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Though Gni's identity has been fairly confirmed in a COIN report, more probably isn't needed. Nonetheless, here he said he would look for founding CAMERA documents and then five days later they were posted on the CAMERA site. It becomes hard to believe that someone who has sockpuppted around a 3RR ban from the CAMERA office for edits on the CAMERA article would claim to know nothing about e-mails from the group. It is also worth noting the timing of the events. --68.72.34.126 (talk) 14:11, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

With this and this? BillyTFried (talk) 04:33, 29 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks it also seems I will have more ridiculous behavior to deal with from our plebian-hating friend Calton with him trying to remove the quite notable fact that Nader has called for impeachment from Nader's article. BillyTFried (talk) 04:30, 30 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes he did. That's why I wrote that Nader's the only current candidate who did. BillyTFried (talk) 01:06, 31 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, you're probably right. I'll just leave it for now and see how things develop. BillyTFried (talk) 02:59, 2 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on Racism in the United States. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions in a content dispute within a 24 hour period. Additionally, users who perform a large number of reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring, even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing. Please do not repeatedly revert edits, but use the talk page to work towards wording and content that gains a consensus among editors. If necessary, pursue dispute resolution. Uncle Milty (talk) 00:29, 6 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You are the only editor who seems to have a problem with the "poorly sourced" contributions. Perhaps there needs to be more of a consensus among editors on this opinion. Uncle Milty (talk) 01:36, 6 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

2 things: It doesn't appear to be "poorly sourced," and you have also developed a pattern of deleting content that doesn't coincide with your point of view. Please review Neutral point of view. Uncle Milty (talk) 01:44, 6 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I see nothing wrong with any of those references. The one you seem to dislike the most (Loompanics) includes 26 references of its own in that article. It's your opinion that these are "weak sources." —Preceding unsigned comment added by Uncle Milty (talk • contribs) 02:10, 6 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

J Street
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7349371.stm BillyTFried (talk) 00:45, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Heh! Guess it's not a stub anymore! Ya snooze, ya lose I guess! :-P BillyTFried (talk) 18:28, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please see Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents/Statement re Wikilobby campaign for the conclusions of an administrative review concerning the recent controversy over a mailing list run by CAMERA, in which your editing was discussed. -- ChrisO (talk) 22:24, 27 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

After reading Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents/Statement_re_Wikilobby_campaign I'm sorry I suggested going easy on Gni last month at COIN. You were 100% right and a block for him was the right answer then, and now. MBisanz ^talk 23:53, 27 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

All I want to do is give this name in the lead paragraph, indicating that that's the name under which Marx's writing(s) were popularly know in the United States or English-speaking world. I am not making any claim as to their scholarly value. This is the only book form of the text. It must be the cause of the view during the on and after 1959 that Marx was an antisemite. Now you found what appears to be an obscure 1958 imprint, with no showing of the exact title, .... You can complete the list of identification deficiencies. I certainly would want to examine this book (for my personal scholarly evaluation). I thank you for this great find. However, not that it goes against your position, I'm sure you know what I mean.

By Karl Marx, Helen Lederer

Published 1958

Hebrew Union College – Jewish Institute of Religion

Jews

84 pages

Cheers! And thanx. Ludvikus (talk) 19:09, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Again, see the article talk page. The "A World Without Jews" was and is obscure, and it is not "the cause of the view during the on and after 1959 that Marx was an antisemite" as you claim. It was an obscure claim by one author that attempted to make that claim, partly by giving a false title to Marx' article. As I pointed out on the talk page, this was not the first time the claim that Marx was an antisemite was made. Cheers, Boodlesthecat ^Meow? 19:52, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I figured out what you meant. Please look more carefully at what I'm doing. I think you were recless at best at removing my Distinctions & probably did not check everything out. Please look before you leap. Cheers. --Ludvikus (talk) 20:13, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'm trying to minimize the confusion you are creating. Boodlesthecat ^Meow? 21:00, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You probably are unaware of the discussion currently going on at the above. Feel free to express your views there anyway you wish. But I think your probably unaware, fully, of what's going on. --Ludvikus (talk) 20:20, 1 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Unfortunately, Wikipedia has not Disambiguate this term. But it has a scholarly, non-pejorative, usage, which just means all the legal restrictions which Jews inherited from the middle ages. --Ludvikus (talk) 14:38, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, but that's an extremely archaic usage which I doubt has ever been used in the last 150 years. Boodlesthecat ^Meow? 15:04, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

You're absolutely wrong!: Disabilities (disambiguation). --Ludvikus (talk) 15:08, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, you just added that disamb 5 minutes ago--that's hardly proof of anything. Do you have any sources where the term is used in modern times? Boodlesthecat ^Meow? 15:13, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Pick up Any scholarly book on Jewish history (written by a scholar, & someone who knows how to write in English, not someone who uses "goy"). Read up on any good work on Jewish emancipation - Any! This is the Technical/Legal word for the idea. --Ludvikus (talk) 15:19, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Look here:

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Jewish Disabilities Bill (United Kingdom [1859])

Cheers! --Ludvikus (talk) 15:25, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Now lets not waste time on time please. Writers on Law & History use that word. And what a Late date for the Jews to have gotten their legal rights: it's only about 100 years before the Civil Rights movement of the 1960's! --Ludvikus (talk) 15:29, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

OK, I assume that means you have no source showing the expression "Jewish disabilities" appearing in current usage. Where it does appear, it refers to the terminology of the 19th century or earlier. An encyclopedia should not use outdated terminology in its descriptions of a subject; that terminology should be mentioned in it's historical context and usage (we don't call African Americans "Negroes" simply because the term appears in "scholarly" books!) Boodlesthecat ^Meow? 15:32, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• With all due respect, you don't know what you are talking about. Any contemporary scholar will use "disabilities" to describe the legal limitations which Jews suffered. That word did not vanish from our vocabulary simply because you are ignorant of it. Please go out and do some scholarly reading on the matter. --Ludvikus (talk) 19:52, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Instead of insulting me, why don't you show me a source showing the expression "Jewish disabilities" appearing in current usage. Boodlesthecat ^Meow? 20:39, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• (My apology if you are offended - sincerely). But how can I do what you ask? How can I find a current usage if Jews today do not suffer such disabilities. Haven't you heard? They've been emancipated. Can you find me a current useage of emancipated? --Ludvikus (talk) 21:23, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Same goes for manumission. Has the word vanished merely because slavery has? --Ludvikus (talk) 21:31, 2 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]